guns

[oldngray]

 

[Johney]

So in other words, you cannot explain it. Again, like I said, you being a gun owner means, you leave english at the curb, and create something that doesnt exist to fit your demented need to feel safe with an inanimate object.

Why not a bat? Or a blankey?

If your insecurity means the rest of the hundreds of millions of americans have to fear gun owners, then I think you are the one with the problem.

I get it, the comma is a little inconvenient for you in your argument. I also asked you not to fall back onto the supreme courts ruling. I asked for your explanation how the commas explain conjuntive meanings vs. the stand alone meanings you want to assign the second amendment.

There are NOT phrases in the second amendment, there are fragments, fragments that conjunctively attach themselves to the preamble.. "a well regulated militia,"

Using your logic, if we connect the last two fragments separated by a comma yet give them one meaning, how do you then explain the first two fragments, as to themselves, standing alone, have no meaning?

"A well regulated militia," By whom? For what reason? Standing alone, it has no meaning.

" ,being necessary for the security of the state, " What security? what state? What is being secured? Standing alone, it means nothing.

" the right of the people to keep and bear arms, " Ok, what about that right? Is it removed? Is it protected? Is it stupid? Standing alone, it has no meaning.

",shall not be infringed." What shall not be infringed? Standing alone, it has no meaning.

You on the other hand, want to claim that only the last two parts complete a meaning, even though separated by a comma, and anyone with a decent education knows that conjunctively, the comma connects both parts, BUT, and this is a GIANT BUT, it also means that everything before those two fragments also CONNECT, giving a complete meaning.

Somehow, gun owners want to ignore the construction of the second amendment, and extract only the portions they believe apply to them and giving the second amendment and different interpretation.

Its clear to anyone with a decent education what the sentence is intended to mean. In 1791, the founders needed an armed force to deal with not only the british, but the indians and the slaves as well. They also knew, that land grabbers had to be fended off and states borders protected as they were created.

Since there were no navy, marines, army, air force or national guard, the civilian militias is all they could rely upon.

They had to be regulated by the government and subject to on call status by a simple or of the president.

But, as anyone knows, leaving an armed populace in place would also threaten the newly formed government, so a limitation on weapons and ammo was placed upon the militias.

Also, age and race played the biggest part of the regulation of the second amendment. YOU believe, that the founders wanted all citizens to own guns, as many as they wanted, yet, slaves couldnt own guns, mexicans couldnt own guns, women couldnt own guns. Further, the founders knew that older white men with guns poised a larger problem as they would get to a point where they knew too much, and this could jeopardize the new government, so a restriction on age was inserted into the militia act.

ONLY white men ages 18 to 45 could be in the militia, and if you were older than that, then sorry bub, NO GUNS FOR YOU.

Now, if you want to propose that the founders intended on ALL civilians to be armed, then you are clearly going against our history, considering, at the time, if they found a black man with a gun, he was instantly hanged by the neck until he was dead. Indians were shot, and mexicans shot and killed for owning guns.

Now, considering that you are white, you may now want to change history and its intentions.

How do you reconcile, that slavery was included in our constitution and civil rights only applied to white men, and yet today, you want to tell us , that the founders intended everyone to be able to own guns??

Notice by the way, how many comma's i've used in this post and yet, you seem to understand what I am talking about.

Peace.

TOS.

Yawn.

 

[moreluck]

 

[BigUnionGuy]

So, what's your point?

I thought it was kind of obvious.

When I quoted TOS.... I underlined, a redundant statement he always makes.

So, to rebut that.... I posted what I did.

Maybe he was suggesting that certain races have a genetic disposition to crime.

Nope.

But, there is a disproportionate amount incarcerated.

Or maybe he was pointing out the inequalities of the American justice system.

Absolutely.

I am a firm believer.... that, you only get as much "justice" as you can afford.

Maybe he just likes charts, I know I do.

I do like the graphic representation of statistics.

i'm betting you don't sit around hoping you'll have to use your Fire Extinguisher or First Aid kit as much as you sit around hoping you can be Charles Bronson or Clint Eastwood. and thinking having a gun is on the same level as having a First Aid Kit or Fire Extinguisher is one of the most absurd things I have ever read on this forum

Your perception of lawful gun owners (and people licensed to carry) is misguided.

Referencing fictional characters.... created by Hollywood.... enforce that sterotype.


Just because people, choose to take an affirmative approach to self defense....

Is No different, than having emergency medical supplies, food, water, etc.


Look at areas that are prone to natural disasters. (Or, have been through one)

The one's that survive (longer).... are the people, that are prepared.

 

[728ups]

Your perception of lawful gun owners (and people licensed to carry) is misguided.

Referencing fictional characters.... created by Hollywood.... enforce that sterotype.


Just because people, choose to take an affirmative approach to self defense....

Is No different, than having emergency medical supplies, food, water, etc.


Look at areas that are prone to natural disasters. (Or, have been through one)

The one's that survive (longer).... are the people, that are prepared.

I have ZERO doubts my perception of Soberups' fantasies with him being a 'hero' in a shoot out is dead on 100%.

 

[728ups]

he's a troll ... has been from the day this thead started... along with a few...

so, people who disagree with you are 'trolls'?
I truly expect this type of thinking from teh Religious Right,no surprises

 

[soberups]

I have ZERO doubts my perception of Soberups' fantasies with him being a 'hero' in a shoot out is dead on 100%.

So people who disagree with you are Dirty Harry wannabes?
I truly expect this type of thinking from the Nanny State Left, no surprises.

 

[wayfair]

so, people who disagree with you are 'trolls'?
I truly expect this type of thinking from teh Religious Right,no surprises

religious right?? this guy's got jokes..

 

[wayfair]

Cmon bro, you have said it yourself many times on this board. We can tell from your posts that you are that "personality" type that thinks they have it all figured out come a shoot out.

The old John Wayne syndrome.

You have told us stories, like the one where you pick up a black hitchhiker, and then put her up front with your wife, and you sit in the back with your hand on your gun, using your wife as bait, just hoping the black man would do something so you could draw your weapon and blow his brains out.

Those are your own words, not ours.

Those stupid "inanimate" objects as you like to call them when you defend them as harmless, yet, you cant leave your home without one, nor can you live in your home without feeling the need to have one loaded, nor can you escape the very constant thought about them.

Obsessive come to mind?

I love my harley davidson motorcycles, but I also drive my cars and trucks. I dont live every waking second of my life creating a false need to be on the motorcycle.

Its a hobby, as should be your guns.

But in a world, where in your mind, you are trapped and held prisoner by false illusions of grandeur, its clear you are hoping to be "that guy" that gets to shoot a bad guy at a mcdonalds, target, walmart, gas station, nursery school, elementary school or even your front yard.

Then, it isnt about the second amendment as it is your pyschological disorder.

But please, spare us the denial.

TOS.

you sound like you have beginning signs of Dementia... you shouldn't own a gun

 

[728ups]

So people who disagree with you are Dirty Harry wannabes?
I truly expect this type of thinking from the Nanny State Left, no surprises.

Mate...............its WAY too obvious you spend a great deal of time on here and in real life dreaming of being being the hero in a fantasy shoot out , really we can all see it.

 

[728ups]

religious right?? this guy's got jokes..

erm no mate the Republicans,the Tea Party and the Religious Right have the market cornered in jokes and fantasies

 

[oldngray]

Then why is everyone on Comedy Central a liberal?

 

[wayfair]

erm no mate the Republicans,the Tea Party and the Religious Right have the market cornered in jokes and fantasies

you barely grasp the 2nd amendment... please don't go after the 1st one

 

[728ups]

"According to the US Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) non-Hispanic blacks accounted for 39.4% of the total prison and jail population in 2009 (841,000 black males and 64,800 black females out of a total of 2,096,300 males and 201,200 females).[46] According to the2010 census of the US Census Bureau blacks (including Hispanic blacks) comprised 13.6% of the US population.[47][48][49]

Hispanics (of all races) were 20.6% of the total jail and prison population in 2009.[46] Hispanics comprised 16.3% of the US population according to the 2010 US census.[47][50] The Northeast has the highest incarceration rates of Hispanics in the nation.[51] Connecticut has the highest Hispanic-to-White incarceration ratio with 6.6 Hispanic males for every white male. The National Average Hispanic-to-White incarceration ratio is 1.8. Other states with high Hispanic-to-White incarcerations include Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and New York.[52]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States

Blacks as a population make far less money than whites and dont have the resources to purchase the White Man's Justice.
Also the laws are a bit racist: the penalties for having/selling/using Crack Cocaine( the Black populations choice of Cocaine) are FAR more sever than having/selling/using powdered Cocaine(the Whit Populations choice of Cocaine

 

[728ups]

you barely grasp the 2nd amendment... please don't go after the 1st one

I have an excellent grasp of both thanks.

 

[soberups]

Mate...............its WAY too obvious you spend a great deal of time on here and in real life dreaming of being being the hero in a fantasy shoot out , really we can all see it.

You see only what your fears and prejudices allow you to see.

Its unfortunate, really. On most social issues--like reproductive freedom for women, gay rights, organized labor, the enviorment, affordable health care---you and I are probably in agreement. You just cant overcome your nanny-state mentality when it comes to the idea of taking personal responsibility for your own self defense. Maybe its one of those urban vs. rural things, I dont know. I bet you never got to go hunting or camping when you were young.

 

[728ups]

You see only what your fears and prejudices allow you to see.

Its unfortunate, really. On most social issues--like reproductive freedom for women, gay rights, organized labor, the enviorment, affordable health care---you and I are probably in agreement. You just cant overcome your nanny-state mentality when it comes to the idea of taking personal responsibility for your own self defense. Maybe its one of those urban vs. rural things, I dont know. I bet you never got to go hunting or camping when you were young.

you'd be rather surprised. i'm half Brit and half Redneck . In the fall we started with Dove,then had deer season. ( i am too soft hearted now, I cant kill anything now) .I love taking the grandkids out and fishing with worms they get QUITE excited when the bobber goes under. I just dont feel the need to carry a gun every where I go,nor do think it's the best answer for most problems. I do have a couple of shotguns in the house(family heirlooms if you will) but due to the grandkids coming over so often I keep them locked away and unloaded.
I know my dogs and alarms are FAR better protection than trying to fumble with a gun in the dark ( i do keep an old golf club handy for Opossums eeating the food i put out for the feral cats) and I feel that 911 will solve the problem quicker than me trying to be a hero.
I dont consider being part of a 'nanny state' i consider it being an ADULT and making SMART decisions

and yes aside from guns you and I agree on about everything else,especially giving dogs treats as dogs rule. they are MUCH better people than humans!

 

[moreluck]

Pip pip ya'll !!
So around your house it's spotted dick with possum sauce ?

 

[wayfair]

I know my dogs and alarms are FAR better protection than trying to fumble with a gun in the dark ( i do keep an old golf club handy for Opossums eeating the food i put out for the feral cats) and I feel that 911 will solve the problem quicker than me trying to be a hero.
I dont consider being part of a 'nanny state' i consider it being an ADULT and making SMART decisions

"When seconds count the police are only minutes away."

"911 is completely ineffective in stopping power against someone who has the will to harm you."

 

[728ups]

Pip pip ya'll !!
So around your house it's spotted dick with possum sauce ?

nah more like bangers and grits