Local 2727 UPDATE

[Dustyroads]

I wonder if Asian managers and supervisors are "far superior" to the ones we have here in the USA as well? tsk, tsk, tsk...maybe we should just outsource the whole dang company to Asians who are far superior...

 

[Cookdaddy]

This is typical of a union mechanic that knows absolutely nothing about me, my skills, my history, or even who I am ASSUMING that he is in a position to make a judgement about me, UPS management, or even how to post something that is worth reading.
UPS should have never become an airline, because all the fears came true about union being greedy and not part of the solution.
Asian mechanics are far superior to you and your fellow thugs. They really are. If you open your eyes and look instead of constantly complaining and looking to throw a wrench in the works. It's people like you that are driving the work there. I know you are incapable of acknowledging anyone else's POV but the unions.
This thread is becoming boring.

" He's had his mind sifted...or mind ripped, depending on how much force was used. We can record every thought, every bit of knowledge in a man's mind. Of course when that much force is used, the mind is emptied....permanently, I'm afraid. Whats left is more vegetable than human."
-KOR- Star Trek TOS

 

[SKYKING BIRDMAN]

Just out of curiosity, what type of concessions would you be willing to consider to help UPS get back to a competitve player in the small package express market?

Note now I said consider, not automatically accept.

If the answer is absolutely none, then I have to ask, who is that is not negotiating in good faith?

I don't want to give any concessions. I just don't want to go backwards. At this point I will be happy to continue under our current contract until we have changes on both sides.

 

[Wow!!]

I stand to be corrected. 1% is not a concession it is a slap in the face considering that doesn't even cover the cost of living. Again, lock everyone in a room come to an agreement of what can work for both sides not for one side. The company is continuing to be profitable. UPS is in the news everyday talking about buying new stuff from aircraft to new state of art equipment "going green" and donating to all causes. How about taking care of your own for a change?

 

[brownIEman]

We will not take any concessions! UPS is poor mouthing us in order to gain an upper hand in negotiations. They poor mouthed us 4 years ago when the economy was strong, and they are doing the same now....Thats why they are not negotiating in good faith. UPS does not give a rat's a** about anyone in this company! They are a huge company that lost its soul when they sold-out to Wall Street. UPS can always count on people like you to take it in the a** for the COMPANY! But eventually you won't have any a** left to give and will be disgarded....For the good of the COMPANY of course!

so you wont even listen to anything the company states about its position. When someone even mentions the possibility of just hearing an argument about it, you curse at them and call them a sell out and spew invectives and labor slogans but no rational arguments. That is not negotiating at all, much less negotiating in good faith.

I would be open to arguments that the company is not negotiating in good faith, but if your union has any where near the attitude you are displaying here, I have no doubt your side is NOT negotiating in good faith.

 

[Wow!!]

This is really funny or maybe it isn't so funny, because there are people making decisions playing this game viewing it like the movie "Trading Places". All of this is are over a one dollar bet saying that we're going to mess with these people and they'll respond this way. They're totally unaware of what is happening to their company and could care less just as long as they're making their money. "It was the Dukes." "It was the Dukes." Does anyone know or care what it is doing to the company? Does anyone think that the people that are being laid off are sitting at home aimlessly waiting for their call back will be back when it is their turn to be called back? Plenty of good people are being laid off that were integral members of their speculative positions that were burned by this. It will be the company's loss, because I would imagine that when it is their turn to be called back they will have done found a place that they will be treated much better. Let's see how they will take it when the smoke clears and will have to kick boxes themselves or be possibly in that unemployment line wondering what the heck happened because they'll be the only ones left.

 

[Dis-organized Labor]

" He's had his mind sifted...or mind ripped, depending on how much force was used. We can record every thought, every bit of knowledge in a man's mind. Of course when that much force is used, the mind is emptied....permanently, I'm afraid. Whats left is more vegetable than human."
-KOR- Star Trek TOS

You're a piece of work.

 

[Cookdaddy]

You're a piece of work.

"Surely I have made may meaning plain. I mean to avenge myself upon you. I deprive your ship of power and when I swing around you I mean to deprive you of your life! But I wanted you to know first who it was who had beaten you.
-KHAN- Star Trek TOS

 

[JETDOC]

You're a piece of work.

NO SOUP FOR YOU !! ....... round eye ?

 

[mrv]

so you wont even listen to anything the company states about its position. When someone even mentions the possibility of just hearing an argument about it, you curse at them and call them a sell out and spew invectives and labor slogans but no rational arguments. That is not negotiating at all, much less negotiating in good faith.

I would be open to arguments that the company is not negotiating in good faith, but if your union has any where near the attitude you are displaying here, I have no doubt your side is NOT negotiating in good faith.

Take you rose colored glasses off and think about whats happening to All UPSers. They have created an enviroment of hate and discontent in all operations. They treat their supervisors with contempt and slash their benifits,pay and morale at every opportunity.

As far as 2727 they layed off 160 people as a negotiating tool. They claim flt reductions and the economy, but no other job functions have been layed off in the airline except for aircraft maintenance. There are 920 mechanics and 430 management people in aircraft maintenance....but no management layoffs. So I can only conclude that we are being targeted because of contract negotiations. These layoffs are nothing more that strong arm tactics to get our E-board to accept concessions. Does not sound like negotiating in good faith to me.

I know you want to think about the good old days when UPS cared about their people, but those days are over. UPS's old traditions , policy book and the very essence of what made this a great company are lost. You guys in management will take the worse of it because you have no recourse except to quit.

 

[ACE]

none of which contains any thing approaching a concession.

I realize that you work with numbers, but can't you read letters? We have taken involuntary concessions. They have broken the contract and outsourced our work. They have laid off approximately (here's a number for you) 160 mechanics, no other workgroup in this company has been hit like we have. If business is down where are the layoffs in IE? Surely if you don't need 160 mechanics you could surely get rid of (another number) 10 in IE? I do agree with you that our E board are IdEots but nothing we can do about that until we can vote them out and start over.

UPS should have never become an airline, because all the fears came true about union being greedy and not part of the solution.
Asian mechanics are far superior to you and your fellow thugs. They really are. If you open your eyes and look instead of constantly complaining and looking to throw a wrench in the works.

They never have or will be an airline! You are probably correct, some of the Asian mechanics are far superior to the ones that UPS hired. You are wrong if you don't believe that UPS doesn't want animosity in its ranks. UPS has hired far too many ex-union mechanics for me to believe that for one second. UPS survives by creating animosity, they waller in it like a pig to slop. Probably why they liked hiring all those pig farmers too, figured they'd be used to such behavior. You have no idea what you are talking about, as usual.

so you wont even listen to anything the company states about its position. When someone even mentions the possibility of just hearing an argument about it, you curse at them and call them a sell out and spew invectives and labor slogans but no rational arguments. That is not negotiating at all, much less negotiating in good faith.

You may be (here's a number for you) 100% correct. Do you know how the process works? We have no idea what out elected IdEot Board is asking for. I do feel that Combine's ego is such that he believes that he has to get a better contract than Darmento. Obviously Combine ain't the man to pull this off. Everybody is screwed, even IE.

"A single blow must destroy the enemy... without regard of losses... a gigantic all-destroying blow."
- Adolf Hitler​

 

[Dis-organized Labor]

I realize that you work with numbers, but can't you read letters? We have taken involuntary concessions. They have broken the contract and outsourced our work. They have laid off approximately (here's a number for you) 160 mechanics, no other workgroup in this company has been hit like we have. If business is down where are the layoffs in IE? Surely if you don't need 160 mechanics you could surely get rid of (another number) 10 in IE? I do agree with you that our E board are IdEots but nothing we can do about that until we can vote them out and start over.



They never have or will be an airline! You are probably correct, some of the Asian mechanics are far superior to the ones that UPS hired. You are wrong if you don't believe that UPS doesn't want animosity in its ranks. UPS has hired far too many ex-union mechanics for me to believe that for one second. UPS survives by creating animosity, they waller in it like a pig to slop. Probably why they liked hiring all those pig farmers too, figured they'd be used to such behavior. You have no idea what you are talking about, as usual.



You may be (here's a number for you) 100% correct. Do you know how the process works? We have no idea what out elected IdEot Board is asking for. I do feel that Combine's ego is such that he believes that he has to get a better contract than Darmento. Obviously Combine ain't the man to pull this off. Everybody is screwed, even IE.

"A single blow must destroy the enemy... without regard of losses... a gigantic all-destroying blow."
- Adolf Hitler​

Anyone that quotes Adolf Hitler has no creditability
I think I'll report you for being a Nazi

 

[brownIEman]

Take you rose colored glasses off and think about whats happening to All UPSers. They have created an enviroment of hate and discontent in all operations. They treat their supervisors with contempt and slash their benifits,pay and morale at every opportunity.

As far as 2727 they layed off 160 people as a negotiating tool. They claim flt reductions and the economy, but no other job functions have been layed off in the airline except for aircraft maintenance. There are 920 mechanics and 430 management people in aircraft maintenance....but no management layoffs. So I can only conclude that we are being targeted because of contract negotiations. These layoffs are nothing more that strong arm tactics to get our E-board to accept concessions. Does not sound like negotiating in good faith to me.

I know you want to think about the good old days when UPS cared about their people, but those days are over. UPS's old traditions , policy book and the very essence of what made this a great company are lost. You guys in management will take the worse of it because you have no recourse except to quit.

Take your hate colored classes off. UPS is run by its management, so, no, we will not take the worst of it. You said it yourself, no mangement layoffs...yet. We take care of our own, but we also ask more of our own. Hense, what you have seen this year, management get no raise, no 401k match, reduced DESPP benefit. But no layoffs...yet.

You are correct about one thing. The old days are over. But not in the way you think. The policy book is still in force, the traditions are still there. What has changed is the days of constant often double digit growth in volume and revenue. It was easy, even necessary, to keep everyone and even always be hiring new blood when your company is continually growing hand over fist. And even to grow salaries at a good clip. That is an easy state for an employer and its employees to be in. But what happens when the growth in volume stalls? Stops? Declines? Then you do not need as many people and if you try to keep them all, you will eventually lose them all. UPS has not shifted as a work place from the days of old to screw with you or to piss you off. It has shifted because the market has shifted, and if UPS does not make the correct adjustments, it will go the way of the Dodo (or DHL domestic).

I admit it is possible the layoffs in your ranks were a negotiating tool, but I would suspect it just might also have something to do with the large decrease in express volume of the past year. The lack of layoffs in Management...yet, are a result of the management owner/operator culture at UPS. The management ranks have been reduced, and continue to be reduced. The hope is the appropriat numbers of management can be reached by attrition, not promoting to replace retiring/leaving mangement, rather than layoffs. If that does not prove to be enough to garner the cost cuts needed to match the revenue cuts, then eventually there will be layoffs in management, count on it.

 

[Dis-organized Labor]

Take your hate colored classes off. UPS is run by its management, so, no, we will not take the worst of it. You said it yourself, no mangement layoffs...yet. We take care of our own, but we also ask more of our own. Hense, what you have seen this year, management get no raise, no 401k match, reduced DESPP benefit. But no layoffs...yet.

You are correct about one thing. The old days are over. But not in the way you think. The policy book is still in force, the traditions are still there. What has changed is the days of constant often double digit growth in volume and revenue. It was easy, even necessary, to keep everyone and even always be hiring new blood when your company is continually growing hand over fist. And even to grow salaries at a good clip. That is an easy state for an employer and its employees to be in. But what happens when the growth in volume stalls? Stops? Declines? Then you do not need as many people and if you try to keep them all, you will eventually lose them all. UPS has not shifted as a work place from the days of old to screw with you or to piss you off. It has shifted because the market has shifted, and if UPS does not make the correct adjustments, it will go the way of the Dodo (or DHL domestic).

I admit it is possible the layoffs in your ranks were a negotiating tool, but I would suspect it just might also have something to do with the large decrease in express volume of the past year. The lack of layoffs in Management...yet, are a result of the management owner/operator culture at UPS. The management ranks have been reduced, and continue to be reduced. The hope is the appropriat numbers of management can be reached by attrition, not promoting to replace retiring/leaving mangement, rather than layoffs. If that does not prove to be enough to garner the cost cuts needed to match the revenue cuts, then eventually there will be layoffs in management, count on it.

These people will never accept any attempt to objectively explain anything. Being objective and optimistic is not in their DNA.
You'll see.

 

[Jetfixr]

It's unfortunate that the current band of idiots have to run off people who know how to run a line, check, weekend work, engine changes, etc. The mindset that the 23yr old can do it is fine but when the 30yr old is from the other side with no airline experience or even airplane experience just wait and see what is going to happen, the authorities will intervene. You can only *u** up so much and then it will not be tolerated any more. As for the strike and the billboards, you guys need to give them just like in the Lexus ad campaign "November to remember" but they are stupid, and act too good far anything so guys, pour it on. Work safe and do what you know how to do make them manage, and get the worth for the money. They have turned the place into the worst run maintenance organization for the majors. Good Luck.
Jet

 

[ACE]

Anyone that quotes Adolf Hitler has no creditability
I think I'll report you for being a Nazi

And where does it state that it is illegal to be a Nazi?

I think I'll report you for being a sep sup. Anyone that doesn't know how to open a door on a 757 has no business supervising maintenance personel and should be reported to the FAA.

"We are all proud that through God's powerful aid, we have become once more true Germans"
- Adolf Hitler​

 

[Lue C Fur]

Asian mechanics are far superior to you and your fellow thugs. They really are. If you open your eyes and look instead of constantly complaining and looking to throw a wrench in the works. It's people like you that are driving the work there. I know you are incapable of acknowledging anyone else's POV but the unions.
This thread is becoming boring.

"Far superior"????? Block turnbacks for leaving gear pins installed., Dumping a crapload of fuel on the ramp., Leaving a rag hanging out of an engine cowl., sure they are "Far superior". I wonder what we will see next from these "Far superior" outsource mechanics.

 

[Cookdaddy]

These people will never accept any attempt to objectively explain anything. Being objective and optimistic is not in their DNA.
You'll see.

"He tasks me! He tasks me! I'll chase him around the outer Nebula and around the Antares Malstoem and round Perditions Flames before I give him up...No...no, you can't get away...from hells heart, I stab at thee...for hates sake, I spit my last breath... at thee..."
-Khan- Star Trek TOS

 

[mrv]

Take your hate colored classes off. UPS is run by its management, so, no, we will not take the worst of it. You said it yourself, no mangement layoffs...yet. We take care of our own, but we also ask more of our own. Hense, what you have seen this year, management get no raise, no 401k match, reduced DESPP benefit. But no layoffs...yet.

You are correct about one thing. The old days are over. But not in the way you think. The policy book is still in force, the traditions are still there. What has changed is the days of constant often double digit growth in volume and revenue. It was easy, even necessary, to keep everyone and even always be hiring new blood when your company is continually growing hand over fist. And even to grow salaries at a good clip. That is an easy state for an employer and its employees to be in. But what happens when the growth in volume stalls? Stops? Declines? Then you do not need as many people and if you try to keep them all, you will eventually lose them all. UPS has not shifted as a work place from the days of old to screw with you or to piss you off. It has shifted because the market has shifted, and if UPS does not make the correct adjustments, it will go the way of the Dodo (or DHL domestic).

I admit it is possible the layoffs in your ranks were a negotiating tool, but I would suspect it just might also have something to do with the large decrease in express volume of the past year. The lack of layoffs in Management...yet, are a result of the management owner/operator culture at UPS. The management ranks have been reduced, and continue to be reduced. The hope is the appropriat numbers of management can be reached by attrition, not promoting to replace retiring/leaving mangement, rather than layoffs. If that does not prove to be enough to garner the cost cuts needed to match the revenue cuts, then eventually there will be layoffs in management, count on it.

Sounds like your reading from a script! UPS IS STOP PROOF! The "Partnership" died along with the "Policy Book" and all the traditions that made UPS a great company when UPS decided to chase the dollar and become a publicly traded company. Now we are slaves to Wall street. Get out of your cubical and talk to real UPSer's, Union and Non-Union and you'll find that this is a very unhappy place. Ultimatly sevice and customers will pay the price and we will fade into the history books. I am glad that you recognize that UPS is not negotiating in good faith and destroying the lives of many good people and their families. What a great company!

BTW- I don't hate UPS...I hate what they have become.

 

[SKYKING BIRDMAN]

Asian mechanics are far superior to you and your fellow thugs. They really are. If you open your eyes and look instead of constantly complaining and looking to throw a wrench in the works. It's people like you that are driving the work there. I know you are incapable of acknowledging anyone else's POV but the unions.
This thread is becoming boring.

What a great American! This is a prime example of whats wrong with this Nation! Just remember this Nation was built on the backs of hard working Americans who only wanted better lives for their families. Your a discrace to this Nation and UPS.