Overboard Termination looking for advice

[UnconTROLLed]

I'm glad our chain smoking sups are restricted to the "break areas" outside nowadays. Smoking is a bad nasty habit that others shouldn't have to put with.

What about chain-smoking hourlies?

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

What about chain-smoking hourlies?

They should be out there swapping cancer smoke with their sups.

 

[Turdferguson]

With boxline, they can start loading them on other sorts, besides preload.

 

[hellfire]

When I get to work in the morning I just put my cooler on the belt and hop on next to it. I ride the belt to my pick who pushes me onto my belt and I slide right up to the back of the truck. What?

 

[km3]

When I get to work in the morning I just put my cooler on the belt and hop on next to it. I ride the belt to my pick who pushes me onto my belt and I slide right up to the back of the truck. What?

Use existing equipment. Seems legit.

 

[Mugarolla]

Progressive discipline, for walking on moving belts ?

You must not be familiar with the ADA case, out of California.


Guy got his arm ripped off....



-Bug-

Very familiar with it. As I stated, immediate discharge. Read my posts and don't post one line out of context.

It is a technicality, but we've lost cases on technicalities also.

They did not terminate him immediately. They continued to allow him to work.

Where I am from, we have won every single one of these cases.

I thought you knew what you were doing. Maybe not.

 

[Work safe or not at all.]

You will get your job back with back pay

 

[BakerMayfield2018]

friend

 

[gorilla75jdw]

It's been a week and you haven't filed a grievance yet?

Re read the last 3 sentences , he filed a grievance

 

[UpstateNYUPSer(Ret)]

You will get your job back....yes....with back pay....no.

 

[Wally]

"Wasn't me" "Don't recall any of that"? Have any witnesses?

 

[Mugarolla]

If we let UPS ignore certain language because of an emotional knee jerk reaction

I mostly agree, but the Central has Article 17 (i).

(i) other cardinal offenses

they will start ignoring even more language

You mean even more than they do now?

But UPS treated him like he committed a cardinal sin when he did not.

Doing something so stupid as to leave yourself open to serious injury or death can be debated as being a cardinal sin or not under 17i.

The stupidity of him walking on a moving belt should have definitely been addressed but that stupidity shouldn't negate contract language.

If he is in the Central or any other supplement that has the "other serious or cardinal" offenses, then it is a matter of opinion on whether this act qualifies. It did not necessarily negate the contract language.

A good steward or BA would be all over that, along with the fact that he was permitted to continue to work

My point to also. We have never lost a case like this. The cases like this are not even heard.

Point of order at the local level. If it was so serious a violation, why was he not terminated on the spot? Why was he allowed to continue to work?

If UPS disagrees, the case does not continue to be heard. The hearing is over and the Point of Order goes to the panel. That is all they rule on. They don't see the case or know why he was fired. (Theoretically).

Every one we have taken to the panel has the Point of Order upheld.

This puts the employee back to work with full back pay and termination expunged.

 

[BigUnionGuy]

Read my posts and don't post one line out of context.

Fair enough.

Doing something so stupid as to leave yourself open to serious injury or death can be debated as being a cardinal sin or not under 17i.

More or less, the point I was trying to make.

Point of order at the local level. If it was so serious a violation, why was he not terminated on the spot? Why was he allowed to continue to work?

That's the proper position to take.

But....

From a liability standpoint, the grievant should be advised and in agreement.

After all, it's their job on the line.

If UPS disagrees, the case does not continue to be heard. The hearing is over and the Point of Order goes to the panel. That is all they rule on. They don't see the case or know why he was fired. (Theoretically).

Theoretically ? Sure.


Real world ?


Everyone, knows what the case is about.

Both sides discuss it in the pre-panel meeting.

After all.... both sides are trying to win.

(And influence their respective Panel Members)


Aside from the California case;


I personally saw the results of a part-time supervisor, who had the flesh stripped off

the palm of her hand when she was walking on a moving belt.

She lost her balance.... and went to grab for something....


I don't condone stupidity.

Progressive discipline (on this issue) is a wash with me.



-Bug-

 

[Mugarolla]

Fair enough.





More or less, the point I was trying to make.





That's the proper position to take.

But....

From a liability standpoint, the grievant should be advised and in agreement.

After all, it's their job on the line.





Theoretically ? Sure.


Real world ?


Everyone, knows what the case is about.

Both sides discuss it in the pre-panel meeting.

After all.... both sides are trying to win.

(And influence their respective Panel Members)


Aside from the California case;


I personally saw the results of a part-time supervisor, who had the flesh stripped off

the palm of her hand when she was walking on a moving belt.

She lost her balance.... and went to grab for something....


I don't condone stupidity.

Progressive discipline (on this issue) is a wash with me.



-Bug-

Well said bug.

 

[Overpaid Union Thug]

I mostly agree, but the Central has Article 17 (i).

(i) other cardinal offenses



You mean even more than they do now?



Doing something so stupid as to leave yourself open to serious injury or death can be debated as being a cardinal sin or not under 17i.



If he is in the Central or any other supplement that has the "other serious or cardinal" offenses, then it is a matter of opinion on whether this act qualifies. It did not necessarily negate the contract language.



My point to also. We have never lost a case like this. The cases like this are not even heard.

Point of order at the local level. If it was so serious a violation, why was he not terminated on the spot? Why was he allowed to continue to work?

If UPS disagrees, the case does not continue to be heard. The hearing is over and the Point of Order goes to the panel. That is all they rule on. They don't see the case or know why he was fired. (Theoretically).

Every one we have taken to the panel has the Point of Order upheld.

This puts the employee back to work with full back pay and termination expunged.

We don't have that "Other Cardinal Sins" garbage in our supplement. That is pure garbage. How did you guys ever let that language into yours?

To be fair.....many people outside of my region could ask the same question about the language in our supplement that allows for part-timers to deliver ground as "TCDs."

 

[Mugarolla]

We don't have that "Other Cardinal Sins" garbage in our supplement. That is pure garbage. How did you guys ever let that language into yours?

To be fair.....many people outside of my region could ask the same question about the language in our supplement that allows for part-timers to deliver ground as "TCDs."

Because we don't have enough people willing to stand up to the union and UPS at the same time.

 

[Orion inc.]

Nope.

NTTFP

Yes you've admitted to doing it before on here. Guess you didn't scan the EAM in the building and falsify records also?

 

[Work safe or not at all.]

Yes, and yes

 

[barnyard]

Surprised you were not immediately walked out and am even more surprised that you did not know that would happen. I was a preloader and knew it from day 1.

 

[Sometimes]

So many perfect employees out there. Kid made a mistake and he owned it. Why are people taking shots at him. Seems many want to take down anyone who try's to do something good for the company or co workers. In the old days I would ride flat on the belt just to massage my aching back.