Religion

[Integrity]

What would you say, if anything, in response to seeing a Stewardship Report while attending church services this weekend that said your church was $21,000 behind in giving?

 

[Fred's Myth]

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What would you say, if anything, in response to seeing this Steward Report while attending church services this weekend?

Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's.

God doesn't value mankind's legal tender.

 

[Integrity]

Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's.

God doesn't value mankind's legal tender.

Wut?

Plain English might help.

 

[Fred's Myth]

Wut?

Plain English might help.

The seven gifts of the Holy Spirit are : wisdom, understanding, counsel, fortitude, knowledge, piety, and fear of the Lord.

I don't see any fiduciary gifts there, do you?

 

[upschuck]

Do you understand the difference between wages for work done, and a gift?

When you are compensated for your labor, your transaction is complete with no expectation of further obligation.

When you are given a gift, there is the expectation of a response: a show of gratitude, reciprocation, maybe paying it forward. Expressing gratitude isn't work in exchange for the gift, it is a correct response. So it is with 'good works'.

I believe that I must make reparations (good works) for my sins.

You said yourself that you have to work to pay off your sins. Maybe you mistyped or something.



What's your view on this?

So, people who don't know they are sinning, are perfect in God's eyes. So ignorance really is bliss.

 

[Fred's Myth]

You said yourself that you have to work to pay off your sins. Maybe you mistyped or something.

You misquote me. I said 'good works'. See Matt 25:40-45 for examples.

So, people who don't know they are sinning, are perfect in God's eyes. So ignorance really is bliss.

For a sin, three conditions must exist at the same time.
1. It must be of a grave matter;
2. It must be committed with full knowledge that it is a sin;
3. It must be committed with full consent.

Only God is perfect. And your concept of sin is incorrect. Sin is turning away from God in preference to Self. God gave us rules in order that we might function as family and not wild beasts intent on eliminating perceived threats of others. We do not sin against God because we cannot deprive God of what He needs, we sin against His Creation. When we sin against Creation we damage its perfect harmony, and are then obligated to repair the damage we have done. Thus the requirement for Good Works.

 

[upschuck]

For a sin, three conditions must exist at the same time.
1. It must be of a grave matter;
2. It must be committed with full knowledge that it is a sin;
3. It must be committed with full consent.

Only God is perfect. And your concept of sin is incorrect. Sin is turning away from God in preference to Self. God gave us rules in order that we might function as family and not wild beasts intent on eliminating perceived threats of others. We do not sin against God because we cannot deprive God of what He needs, we sin against His Creation. When we sin against Creation we damage its perfect harmony, and are then obligated to repair the damage we have done. Thus the requirement for Good Works.

So, people who have never heard of God or Jesus will be in heaven, for they will be without sin? How could they have full knowledge that it is a sin, if they don't know what a sin is?

What is your definition of a "grave matter"?

 

[upschuck]

You misquote me. I said 'good works'. See Matt 25:40-45 for examples.

That passage is something we all should be doing because of who we are(a new creation), not because we have sinned.

 

[vantexan]

Hear what you want.

That is between you and the living God.

I cast no stone at you or anyone my friend.

I'm curious. Do you decide for yourself which laws of the state and municipality in which you reside, as well as Federal laws, that you will follow or not follow? Not talking about laws of man that would cause you to violate your conscience as a Christian. Just every day laws that govern how we're to comport ourselves in society. Do you feel you can ignore certain laws if you find them irritating to comply with? Or not necessary or fair in your opinion?

 

[Integrity]

I'm curious. Do you decide for yourself which laws of the state and municipality in which you reside, as well as Federal laws, that you will follow or not follow? Not talking about laws of man that would cause you to violate your conscience as a Christian. Just every day laws that govern how we're to comport ourselves in society. Do you feel you can ignore certain laws if you find them irritating to comply with? Or not necessary or fair in your opinion?

I seek to do all as the Spirit of God leads me.

 

[Integrity]

You misquote me. I said 'good works'. See Matt 25:40-45 for examples.

For a sin, three conditions must exist at the same time.
1. It must be of a grave matter;
2. It must be committed with full knowledge that it is a sin;
3. It must be committed with full consent.

Only God is perfect. And your concept of sin is incorrect. Sin is turning away from God in preference to Self. God gave us rules in order that we might function as family and not wild beasts intent on eliminating perceived threats of others. We do not sin against God because we cannot deprive God of what He needs, we sin against His Creation. When we sin against Creation we damage its perfect harmony, and are then obligated to repair the damage we have done. Thus the requirement for Good Works.

Do you consider murder a grave matter?

Do you consider calling someone a fool a grave matter?

 

[vantexan]

I seek to do all as the Spirit of God leads me.

That's not an answer. Are you as a Christian required to obey the law except where it breaks God's law?

 

[Integrity]

That's not an answer. Are you as a Christian required to obey the law except where it breaks God's law?

As a Christian, in all things I am to follow the leading and counsel of the Holy Spirit of God.

 

[vantexan]

As a Christian, in all things I am to follow the leading and counsel of the Holy Spirit of God.

Then does he direct you to follow your local laws?

 

[Integrity]

Then does he direct you to follow your local laws?

Give me an example please.

 

[vantexan]

Give me an example please.

I've already spelled it out. Do you follow basic laws or do you pick and choose? Traffic laws? Tax laws? Zoning?

 

[Integrity]

I've already spelled it out. Do you follow basic laws or do you pick and choose? Traffic laws? Tax laws? Zoning?

The Holy Spirit has not given me guidance on these specific basic laws.

I pick and choose, as you do.

 

[vantexan]

The Holy Spirit has not given me guidance on these specific basic laws.

I pick and choose, as you do.

So the Holy Spirit hasn't counseled you to obey the law as a Christian? Those of who believe the Holy Spirit speaks to us through his Word know the answer already. We aren't perfect, but we're expected to try, not pick and choose.

 

[Integrity]

So the Holy Spirit hasn't counseled you to obey the law as a Christian?

I will pray about this specific question and let you know the guidance I receive

Those of who believe the Holy Spirit speaks to us through his Word know the answer already.

Drum roll please….

So what is the answer then.

We aren't perfect, but we're expected to try, not pick and choose.

Never said I don’t try but like you I pick and choose as well.

 

[vantexan]

I will pray about this specific question and let you know the guidance I receive

Drum roll please….

So what is the answer then.

Never said I don’t try but like you I pick and choose as well.

I don't pick and choose. When I fail to obey a traffic speed sign or not file my taxes I know I'm not doing the right thing. That's the difference between me and you. You choose to not do something and think it's no big deal because no matter what you do there's no way you can lose your soul if you have accepted Jesus as your savior. So you can go through life only complying with what you choose to.