Religion

[vantexan]

The Bible is clear that God did not send Jesus into the world to condemn the world but to save the world.

You pick a different position and choose to believe that you are free and responsible to condemn others. I don’t agree with your position on this matter but I affirm your right to your opinion.

Do you love humanity?

Of course. Instead of picking apart every race and ethnic group that's not my own I traveled to more than a dozen countries and found wonderful people everywhere I went.

God offers us salvation through Jesus. We condemn ourselves by refusing to believe in him. But belief is more than just saying he's the Son of God. The Bible is very clear on that.

 

[Integrity]

Of course. Instead of picking apart every race and ethnic group that's not my own I traveled to more than a dozen countries and found wonderful people everywhere I went.

God offers us salvation through Jesus. We condemn ourselves by refusing to believe in him. But belief is more than just saying he's the Son of God. The Bible is very clear on that.

Agreed, it is more than just saying it is believing in your heart that He is enough. The Bible teaches only God can see the heart. I believe nothing more is needed but Him.Saved not by works but Him. Lest any man boast.

I pick and choose not to boast that anything apart from the finished work of God through Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit offers me salvation of the soul.

You pick and choose differently if you like, no condemnation from me.

 

[FromOffTheStreets]

Agreed, it is more than just saying it is believing in your heart that He is enough. The Bible teaches only God can see the heart. I believe nothing more is needed but Him.Saved not by works but Him. Lest any man boast.

I pick and choose not to boast that anything apart from the finished work of God through Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit offers me salvation of the soul.

You pick and choose differently if you like, no condemnation from me.

Your getting the "saved by him, not through works right." Many others include works plus him (making Jesus sacrifice insufficient).
What your not comprehending is that good works follow those who are saved. A bad tree cannot bare good fruit & a good tree cannot bare bad fruit.
If you are actually saved by the creator of the universe then you will begin the journey of sanctification. If you have not then you will recite your mantra & continue your life as if nothing has changed.

 

[Integrity]

Your getting the "saved by him, not through works right." Many others include works plus him (making Jesus sacrifice insufficient).
What your not comprehending is that good works follow those who are saved. A bad tree cannot bare good fruit & a good tree cannot bare bad fruit.
If you are actually saved by the creator of the universe then you will begin the journey of sanctification. If you have not then you will recite your mantra & continue your life as if nothing has changed.

God doing good work through believers in Christ is an awesome reality, I firmly believe He does supernatural work in and through His creation. Never said He didn’t. I believe the Bible teaches this.

We are apparently in agreement that salvation is a complete work of God, through Jesus His son, by the power of the Holy Spirit. We appear to also be in agreement that any work of man is incapable of contributing to the salvation of the soul.

We can definitely explore the awesome supernatural works of God in and through believers. There are many in the Bible and many happening in this day, they are a blessing of salvation but not necessary for it.

That is what I put my faith in.( Others might call it picking and choosing).

 

[Fred's Myth]

Agreed, it is more than just saying it is believing in your heart that He is enough. The Bible teaches only God can see the heart. I believe nothing more is needed but Him.Saved not by works but Him. Lest any man boast.

I know that Scripture comes second to your direct communication, but Jesus said “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me." Matt 16:24

The Cross is a burden, a burden is: that which is carried; that which is borne with difficulty; obligation; onus. A burden is not nothing. The Holy Spirit cannot contradict what Jesus said, because they are One.

You've been told before, 'WORKS' is not a substitute for the sacrifice of Jesus. It is an obligation for those who proclaim themselves to be followers, as both a sign that they are believers, and as the service we are also taught by Jesus to perform for our brethren. "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." Matt 5:16

 

[Integrity]

I know that Scripture comes second to your direct communication, but Jesus said “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me." Matt 16:24 Yes accepting God’s will be done not ours. That is the interpretation that I pick and choose to follow.

The Cross is a burden, a burden is: that which is carried; that which is borne with difficulty; obligation; onus. A burden is not nothing. The Holy Spirit cannot contradict what Jesus said, because they are One.Jesus said his yoke is easy and his burden is light. He offered not obligated his yoke. The Bible teaches this.

You've been told before, 'WORKS' is not a substitute for the sacrifice of Jesus. It is an obligation for those who proclaim themselves to be followers, as both a sign that they are believers, and as the service we are also taught by Jesus to perform for our brethren. "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." Matt 5:16 The Bible teaches Jesus is the light of the world. Let Him shine.

 

[Fred's Myth]

I know that Scripture comes second to your direct communication, but Jesus said “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me." Matt 16:24 Yes accepting God’s will be done not ours. That is the interpretation that I pick and choose to follow.

The Cross is a burden, a burden is: that which is carried; that which is borne with difficulty; obligation; onus. A burden is not nothing. The Holy Spirit cannot contradict what Jesus said, because they are One.Jesus said his yoke is easy and his burden is light. He offered not obligated his yoke. The Bible teaches this.

You've been told before, 'WORKS' is not a substitute for the sacrifice of Jesus. It is an obligation for those who proclaim themselves to be followers, as both a sign that they are believers, and as the service we are also taught by Jesus to perform for our brethren. "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." Matt 5:16 The Bible teaches Jesus is the light of the world. Let Him shine.

“I know your works: you are neither cold nor hot. Would that you were either cold or hot! So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth” (Rev. 3:15-16).

 

[Integrity]

“I know your works: you are neither cold nor hot. Would that you were either cold or hot! So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth” (Rev. 3:15-16).

Yes a lukewarm christian is one who relies on their own works and not the work of God in them and through them.

 

[Integrity]

I have observed some teaching about “the Gospel” that I am not convinced is working in a fundamental/evangelical church I attend, this church teaches “biblical christianity”.

The preaching seems to equate “the Bible” with the “good news” of Jesus. My spirit is conflicted by actually equating any religious code with the person of Christ.

I love the Bible, it is of significant importance to me in my religious life, I recognize it contains “ the Good News” but I am not convinced it is the Good News.

Jesus is “the Good News”.

 

[Fred's Myth]

I have observed some teaching about “the Gospel” that I am not convinced is working in a fundamental/evangelical church I attend, this church teaches “biblical christianity”.

The preaching seems to equate “the Bible” with the “good news” of Jesus. My spirit is conflicted by actually equating any religious code with the person of Christ.

I love the Bible, it is of significant importance to me in my religious life, I recognize it contains “ the Good News” but I am not convinced it is the Good News.

Jesus is “the Good News”.

What do you believe you would know about Jesus if there were no Scripture to enlighten you?

Especially since any other historical evidence of His life is obscure.

 

[Integrity]

What do you believe you would know about Jesus if there were no Scripture to enlighten you?

Especially since any other historical evidence of His life is obscure.

I came to faith in God and in Jesus prior to being personally exposed to and utilizing religious scriptures in my life and belief. The religious scriptures came into my life after I believed in God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit , not before.

It is clear that all historical remnants or evidence of any kind religious or non religious is obscure and contingent upon man’s understanding of them.

I personally believe this understanding is given individually, personally, and specifically to each person according to God’s sovereignty over creation.

 

[vantexan]

I came to faith in God and in Jesus prior to being personally exposed to and utilizing religious scriptures in my life and belief. The religious scriptures came into my life after I believed in God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit , not before.

It is clear that all historical remnants or evidence of any kind religious or non religious is obscure and contingent upon man’s understanding of them.

I personally believe this understanding is given individually, personally, and specifically to each person according to God’s sovereignty over creation.

In other words you make it up as you go along.

 

[Fred's Myth]

In other words you make it up as you go along.

That doesn't necessarily make @Integrity wrong, it just makes his journey all the more treacherous.

Kind of like using a piece of equipment without reading the owner's manual.

 

[Integrity]

In other words you make it up as you go along.

No I make nothing up.

I do take what I want and leave the rest.

Just like you my friend.

 

[Integrity]

That doesn't necessarily make @Integrity wrong, it just makes his journey all the more treacherous.

Kind of like using a piece of equipment without reading the owner's manual.

I appreciate your lack of judgement.

You view scriptures as an owners manual?

 

[upschuck]

I came to faith in God and in Jesus prior to being personally exposed to and utilizing religious scriptures in my life and belief. The religious scriptures came into my life after I believed in God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit , not before.

It is clear that all historical remnants or evidence of any kind religious or non religious is obscure and contingent upon man’s understanding of them.

I personally believe this understanding is given individually, personally, and specifically to each person according to God’s sovereignty over creation.

Where do you think the people who exposed you to Jesus, got their information from?

 

[Integrity]

Where do you think the people who exposed you to Jesus, got their information from?

Ultimately from God.

 

[upschuck]

Ultimately from God.

Expound on that. From God to ? to ? to Integrity. What were the steps?

 

[Integrity]

Expound on that. From God to ? to ? to Integrity. What were the steps?

I don’t believe God is information to be passed down or a religion to be followed. I believe God is a person who I believe personally reveals Himself to each person in accordance with His will.

 

[vantexan]

That doesn't necessarily make @Integrity wrong, it just makes his journey all the more treacherous.

Kind of like using a piece of equipment without reading the owner's manual.

I'm sorry but when you reject the Bible because it contains things you don't agree with it makes you wrong. He may be totally sincere that he has a direct connection to God and doesn't necessarily need the Bible but as you pointed out there is little out there beyond the Bible about Jesus. A Christian without the New Testament is absolutely as you said about not having the owner's manual.

"In those days there was no king in Israel: every man did that which was right in his own eyes."

Judges 21:25