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El Correcto

god is dead
The difference between you and me is you don't want to understand where the writers of the Old Testament are coming from. You just dismiss it all as made up fantasy and lies. Take the story of Noah. You would dismiss it out of hand. Someone like Brownflush may believe that two of every creature showed up at the Ark. Perhaps there's an underlying historical event that is the basis for the story. A lot of evidence suggests that the narrow isthmus separating what is now Turkey and Greece broke through spilling the Mediterranean into what is now the Black Sea. The Sumerians had a myth known as the Epic of Gilgamesh. He dealt with a huge flood. The father of the Hebrew nation, Abraham, lived in the Sumerian city of Ur. Noah's flood has a lot in common with the Epic of Gilgamesh.

Certainly the archeological record rules out men and dinosaurs living at the same time, minus today's crocodiles and alligators. Also if you look at mankind around the world every group had/has its mythology and origin stories. Every Native American tribe had its own origin story. Why did the mythology of the Hebrews catch on? Imo it was due to they were one of the first groups with a written language. And Jesus came from the Hebrews/Jews. Two aspects of the Old Testament are very important to Christians. His lineage and prophesies of the Messiah. Beyond that we're completely under the New Testament, not the Old. The Old Testament has homosexuals, for example, put to death. Under the New Testament we are to recognize that we all sin, must try not to, and warn others who are caught up in sin that they're endangering their soul. They are free to reject or accept that. But we aren't to harm them. The state has an obligation to enforce laws, including, if the state requires it, taking someone's life as punishment for murdering others. But we as Christians must not murder. So I may know that you're a homosexual but beyond insisting that your sex life should be kept private if you aren't willing to stop, I would face punishment myself if I harmed you over it. As much as you hate Christianity I hope you realize that this country used to be much more Christian and our basis of do no harm has led to an opening up of society that allows you to be openly gay without fear of harm. You may disagree but when you have a gay pride parade you aren't seeing Christians rioting over it. We believe ultimately we'll all be judged by the lives we live(some don't) and it's up to God. I realize that the fact that we believe homosexuality is a sin(some don't) infuriates you but the Bible lists quite a few sins. We're all dealing with our own lives. Where homosexuality is concerned what I don't want to see are books in school libraries depicting sex acts, straight or gay. And I don't want to see open displays of sexual behavior, gay or straight, as is often exhibited in gay pride parades. Two grown adults are free to do as they please behind closed doors. But if you're going to stick your finger in the eye of Christians publicly expect pushback. Thanks for reading.
Yeah I don’t care about the flood narrative or dispute there might have been a flood that inspired it. Chances are there was a flood that inspired the story, but it isn’t the flood laid out in the Bible.

I don’t really mind people that view the Bible the way you do, as historically inaccurate hyped up nationalist stories of an ancient people loosely based on some sort of origin story passed down through early people in the region. That makes sense, the whole part that doesn’t make sense is basing your world view around it.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Yeah I don’t care about the flood narrative or dispute there might have been a flood that inspired it. Chances are there was a flood that inspired the story, but it isn’t the flood laid out in the Bible.

I don’t really mind people that view the Bible the way you do, as historically inaccurate hyped up nationalist stories of an ancient people loosely based on some sort of origin story passed down through early people in the region. That makes sense, the whole part that doesn’t make sense is basing your world view around it.
I base my world view around the New Testament. Christianity has been the single biggest civilizing force in history. Don't think so? Look at the barbarism that existed across Europe and elsewhere before Christianity. Can you show me the great cities built by the various tribes in Europe before Christianity? No matter how much you hate it European culture, society, government are based on it.
 

El Correcto

god is dead
I base my world view around the New Testament. Christianity has been the single biggest civilizing force in history. Don't think so? Look at the barbarism that existed across Europe and elsewhere before Christianity. Can you show me the great cities built by the various tribes in Europe before Christianity? No matter how much you hate it European culture, society, government are based on it.
Nah they were still pretty barbarous and non Christian empires were stronger.
 

El Correcto

god is dead
Stronger than the British?
Britons yes. British weren’t around in time you’re talking, the spread of Christianity in early Europe, also known as the dark ages because it went so :censored2:ing well, but please tell me more about your wonderful empire building book.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
Britons yes. British weren’t around in time you’re talking, the spread of Christianity in early Europe, also known as the dark ages because it went so :censored2:ing well, but please tell me more about your wonderful empire building book.
Didn't say it's for building empires. But it had a civilizing influence. Instead of taking by force from the next group it brought cooperation. Of course one can argue that those God fearing folk used force on other races and lands. But that wasn't Christianity. That was greed. But the British Empire is just one example of Western Civilization growing under the influence of Christianity. Other groups like the Mongols fell by the wayside.
 

Integrity

Binge Poster
So then in your estimation God is ok with fornication no matter what the Bible says. Interesting theology you've got going there. I'd ask you to expand on that but I don't feel like pulling teeth.
So then in your estimation God is ok with fornication no matter what the Bible says.
Yes I believe what God is ok with or not ok with is not contingent on the Bible.
Interesting theology you've got going there. I'd ask you to expand on that but I don't feel like pulling teeth.
Thank you.
 

El Correcto

god is dead
Didn't say it's for building empires. But it had a civilizing influence. Instead of taking by force from the next group it brought cooperation.
No it didn’t.
Of course one can argue that those God fearing folk used force on other races and lands.
Ah ya don’t say.
But that wasn't Christianity. That was greed.
Didn’t do much to stop it.
But the British Empire is just one example of Western Civilization growing under the influence of Christianity. Other groups like the Mongols fell by the wayside.
British empire grew because of a lot of factors, Christianity isn’t really one. God didn’t literally save the queen. It’s mostly the things you condemn that grew the British Empire, the exploitation and conquest of others.
 

El Correcto

god is dead
I’d say Europe recovered from Christianity and the dark ages, not prospered because of them.
I think both the Greeks and the Roman, probably Egyptians, definitely mongols were more advanced and civilized than Europeans were for a long time.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
No it didn’t.

Ah ya don’t say.

Didn’t do much to stop it.

British empire grew because of a lot of factors, Christianity isn’t really one. God didn’t literally save the queen. It’s mostly the things you condemn that grew the British Empire, the exploitation and conquest of others.
Look at all the Ivy League schools. The great European universities. All started as Christian based schools. Western civilization is based on Judeo-Christian beliefs. Religious leaders led the fight to end slavery.
 

vantexan

Well-Known Member
I’d say Europe recovered from Christianity and the dark ages, not prospered because of them.
I think both the Greeks and the Roman, probably Egyptians, definitely mongols were more advanced and civilized than Europeans were for a long time.
The Greeks and Romans became Christians. Enough said.
 

Integrity

Binge Poster
The tree (knowledge of good and evil) which God told them not to eat of, didn't reveal to them they were naked?


So, we are here without any judgement (knowledge) of what good and evil are?
The tree (knowledge of good and evil) which God told them not to eat of, didn't reveal to them they were naked?
No. I don’t believe the tree revealed anything.
So, we are here without any judgement (knowledge) of what good and evil are?
Only God can have perfect knowledge.
 

BrownFlush

Woke Racist Reigning Ban King
No. I don’t believe the tree revealed anything.
So after they ate the fruit, God did not ask them, who told you that you were naked?
Only God can have perfect knowledge.
That was not what I asked...One more time just so we're crystal clear on how you have perfected deflection and not answering a straight question.....
So, we are here without any judgement (knowledge) of what good and evil are?
 

Integrity

Binge Poster
So after they ate the fruit, God did not ask them, who told you that you were naked?

That was not what I asked...One more time just so we're crystal clear on how you have perfected deflection and not answering a straight question.....
So after they ate the fruit, God did not ask them, who told you that you were naked?
I did not say that.

Is that a direct quote from God from your version of the Bible?
That was not what I asked...One more time just so we're crystal clear on how you have perfected deflection and not answering a straight question.....
judgement and knowledge are not equivalent words.
 
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