Gov healthcare

[klein]

Tie,

What I find funny is Klein accused me of "leaving stuff out" but yet his very copy and paste from the Fraser Institute came thanks to my link buried at the video under "about Dr. Skinner". In other words Klein used my direct link and easily found this information. I guess he does think everyone else here to be morons and incapable of thought and inability to use a computer.

And I thought I was the only one who felt that way!
but with tongue firmly in cheek!

As I said in the beginning, draw your own conclusion!

Did you hear Klein got a job? Yeah, something about using addition and grains of sand!

Gee, you read soo much... and post soo much for us to read...
But, yet , couldn't read how I responded ?????

Wkmac left this out, in his posting earlier.
That the fraser institute is another Liberty movement.
(it all sounds good, but it just doesn't work, because of individual greed).
Thanks to the link he sent, this is thier goals :

And yes, it's important to know where the information comes from, and what goals that site has.

 

[tieguy]

Well, next time you meet Canadians in your city getting healthcare services. Let me know. Write down thier e-mail or better yet, let them post here on BC.
I'll go into your statitics maybe , too.
If I happen to get sick during my stay.

Posters here have already given you numerous examples of canadians leaving your country to get needed healthcare in this country. I personally posted a list of people who had issuesthat was about 50 names long. This whole debate is getting stupid now. I don't need to hang out at medical centers and collect email addresses for you so you can come up with some stupid dodge again.

When I initially challenged you on why you were selling governement run health care here you gave me some type of "I'm here to help answer".
We'll you're not helping.

If you're not going to give us some honest help then you really need to stay out of the discussion.

 

[tieguy]

Tie,

What I find funny is Klein accused me of "leaving stuff out" but yet his very copy and paste from the Fraser Institute came thanks to my link buried at the video under "about Dr. Skinner". In other words Klein used my direct link and easily found this information. I guess he does think everyone else here to be morons and incapable of thought and inability to use a computer.

And I thought I was the only one who felt that way!
but with tongue firmly in cheek!

As I said in the beginning, draw your own conclusion!

Did you hear Klein got a job? Yeah, something about using addition and grains of sand!

Mac,
nice graphic. I'm out of louisville sluggers , his head is too dense.

 

[klein]

Well, next time you meet Canadians in your city getting healthcare services. Let me know. Write down thier e-mail or better yet, let them post here on BC.
I'll go into your statitics maybe , too.
If I happen to get sick during my stay.

Posters here have already given you numerous examples of canadians leaving your country to get needed healthcare in this country. I personally posted a list of people who had issuesthat was about 50 names long. This whole debate is getting stupid now. I don't need to hang out at medical centers and collect email addresses for you so you can come up with some stupid dodge again.

When I initially challenged you on why you were selling governement run health care here you gave me some type of "I'm here to help answer".
We'll you're not helping.

If you're not going to give us some honest help then you really need to stay out of the discussion.

No Tie, I gave up selling you national Healthcare long ago.
All, I'm doing is defending ours.
Just like you defend yours.

Told it before, keep Canada out of this, and so will I keep out of this thread.
Compare it to Japan, or Sweden or even the UK (but UK could be scary, since some of them are here, too).
Then, I can't and won't respond.

 

[tieguy]

No Tie, I gave up selling you national Healthcare long ago.
All, I'm doing is defending ours.
Just like you defend yours.

Told it before, keep Canada out of this, and so will I keep out of this thread.
Compare it to Japan, or Sweden or even the UK (but UK could be scary, since some of them are here, too).
Then, I can't and won't respond.

er..um...bull (cough) sh(cough).

 

[knightablaze]

161 people have died so far by canada conciously deciding to wait a whole month before they started vaccines.

Just think about who's dying from this flu. Pregnant women and kids. 161 of them died because your government decided to wait a month.

Now add in the ones that die in November since they could have been vacinated in october.

Yet here you are the socialist guru trying to tell us that government run health care is the way to go.

Nearly 1000 US citizens have died, despite the earlier approval of the vaccine in mid-september.

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/updates/us/
​

The metadata gathered at this wiki page push the unofficial number of dead to over 2000.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_flu_pandemic_in_the_United_States_by_state
​

Yet here you are, the fascist guru, trying to tell us that corporate run health care is the way to go.

 

[klein]

Funny thing is, this thread was started by a Canadian.
And I bet he is getting a kick out of it.

I know over 2000 died in the US.
But per capita, we are just below those numbers.

And again on the news yesterday... we have given more shots per capita then any other country on earth.
Now 25%.
And, yet, you need to remember this is the largest and one of the most unpopulated countries.
They are doing a great job, if you ask me.

You would think Europe, would do much better.
Like Germany.. only 700 miles to one border to another.
We conquor over 5000 miles from ocean to ocean, and north to south.

To give anyone a clue. Germany fits 3 times into Allberta (just 1 province), and we have 3 Million people living here. Germany has close to 80 million .

California would fit in here, (Alberta), atleast 3 or 4 times, too, with more of a population then all of Canada.

 

[tieguy]

Nearly 1000 US citizens have died, despite the earlier approval of the vaccine in mid-september.

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/updates/us/
​

The metadata gathered at this wiki page push the unofficial number of dead to over 2000.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_flu_pandemic_in_the_United_States_by_state
​

Yet here you are, the fascist guru, trying to tell us that corporate run health care is the way to go.

Facist? Roflmao someones pouting

I hope your communist master provided you with an education
No my pouting friend not a who's better question but a question as to how many people died because the canadian government decided to wait an extra month to roll out their vaccine. Its relevant to the discussion since Klein has been telling us how caring his socialist master is.
Man I should get extra credit for getting facist, communist and socialist in one post.

 

[tieguy]

No Tie, I gave up selling you national Healthcare long ago.
All, I'm doing is defending ours.
Just like you defend yours.

Told it before, keep Canada out of this, and so will I keep out of this thread.
Compare it to Japan, or Sweden or even the UK (but UK could be scary, since some of them are here, too).
Then, I can't and won't respond.

Funny thing is, this thread was started by a Canadian.
And I bet he is getting a kick out of it.

I know over 2000 died in the US.
But per capita, we are just below those numbers.

And again on the news yesterday... we have given more shots per capita then any other country on earth.
Now 25%.
And, yet, you need to remember this is the largest and one of the most unpopulated countries.
They are doing a great job, if you ask me.

You would think Europe, would do much better.
Like Germany.. only 700 miles to one border to another.
We conquor over 5000 miles from ocean to ocean, and north to south.

To give anyone a clue. Germany fits 3 times into Allberta (just 1 province), and we have 3 Million people living here. Germany has close to 80 million .

California would fit in here, (Alberta), atleast 3 or 4 times, too, with more of a population then all of Canada.

I highligted your post where you promised no attacks if no one attacked Canada. Yet you immediately went to another attack on america as highlighted with no further attack on canada.

It appears you broke your promise.

 

[klein]

I highligted your post where you promised no attacks if no one attacked Canada. Yet you immediately went to another attack on america as highlighted with no further attack on canada.

It appears you broke your promise.

No, I haven't.
Get out of your space ship.
The comment above was regarding Canada, that I answered to.

 

[tieguy]

No, I haven't.
Get out of your space ship.
The comment above was regarding Canada, that I answered to.

No no I am afraid you broke your promise...again. The good news is we're getting used to your dishonesty.

 

[klein]

No no I am afraid you broke your promise...again. The good news is we're getting used to your dishonesty.

You are a screwball.
I'm one of the most honest, sincere persons you'll ever meet .

Thats my own religion. To be honest and caring for others.
And , hopefully thats enough to get me into a better place after this life ends.

 

[tieguy]

You are a screwball.
I'm one of the [-]most honest, sincere persons[/-] biggest bull****ters you'll ever meet .

Fixed it for ya buddy.

 

[klein]

Fixed it for ya buddy.

Hey now, be nice.

I want you guys to keep your healthcare, as long as you can afford to do so.

Plain and simple.

 

[Babagounj]

The outright bribe extracted by Sen. Ben Nelson (D-Corn Huckster State) from Sen. Harry Reid.
As a result of Nelson’s performance in his role of Hamlet in the health care deliberations, we will have two health care systems in this country; one for Nebraska and one for the other 49 states.
In its quixotic attempt to ensure everyone has health insurance, the Reid legislation greatly expands Medicaid eligibility.
Because Medicaid is a program whose costs are split between the federal and state governments, this expansion in eligibility raise costs dramatically for states.

States will be forced to either raise taxes or cut other services to accommodate the forced increase in Medicaid spending.
Unless that state is Nebraska.
Nelson's bribe will be that the federal government will forever cover the costs of Medicaid expansion in Nebraska.
Taxpayers in every other state will forever be responsible for the expanded Medicaid program in Nebraska.
Contact your senator and demand an equal bribe.

 

[Jones]

Supposed highlights of the Senate healthcare bill. You can read the whole thing here.

[FONT=times new roman, times, serif]Manager’s Amendment to the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act

Providing More Competition & Affordable Choices for Americans

The Manager’s Amendment to the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act builds upon the strong bill we already have. It demands greater accountability from health insurance companies while creating more choice and competition for consumers. It implements new programs to further rein in health costs and makes health insurance policies more affordable; and it improves access to quality, affordable health care for children and vulnerable populations.

Tougher Accountability Policies for Health Insurance Companies

• Stronger medical loss ratios. Health insurers will be required to spend more of their premium revenues on clinical services and quality activities, with less going to administrative costs and profits – or else pay rebates to policyholders. These stricter limits will continue even after the Exchanges begin in 2011, and apply to all plans, including grandfathered plans.

• Accountability for excessive rate increases. A health insurer’s participation in the Exchanges will depend on its performance. Insurers that jack up their premiums before the Exchanges begin will be excluded – a powerful incentive to keep premiums affordable.

• Immediate ban on pre-existing condition exclusions for children. Health insurers will be immediately prohibited from excluding coverage of pre-existing conditions for children.

• Patient protections. Health insurers will have to abide by a set of patient protections that, for example, protect choice of doctors and ensure access to emergency care.

• Ensuring access to needed care. The use of annual limits on benefits will be tightly restricted to ensure access to needed care immediately, and will be prohibited completely beginning in 2014.

• Guaranteed opportunity to appeal coverage denials. All health insurers will be required to implement an internal appeals process for coverage denials, and states will ensure the availability of an external appeals process that is independent and holds insurance companies accountable.

Stronger Policies to Make Health Care Affordable

• Innovation. Medicare will be able to test new models and, if successful, implement them via a stronger Innovation Center, Independent Payment Advisory Board, and other authorities.

• Transparency. New requirements will ensure that insurers and health care providers report on their performance, empowering patients to make the best possible decisions.

• Small businesses. A package of improvements include starting the health insurance tax credit in 2010, expanding eligibility for the credit, and improving the purchasing power of small businesses.

More Health Insurance Choices

• Multi-state option. Health insurance carriers will offer plans under the supervision of the Office of Personnel Management, the same entity that oversees health plans for Members of Congress. At least one plan must be non-profit, and the plans will be available nationwide. This will promote competition and choice.

• Free choice vouchers. Workers who qualify for an affordability exemption to the individual responsibility policy but do not qualify for tax credits can take their employer contribution and join an exchange plan.

Improved Access to Quality Health Care for Seniors, Children, and Vulnerable Populations

• Quality of care in Medicare. Seniors will benefit when additional health care providers are reimbursed by Medicare for the quality of care they deliver, not the quantity of services they provide.

• Children’s health. Support will be extended for the Children’s Health Insurance Program and the adoption tax credit. Foster care children aging out of Medicaid will be able to retain its comprehensive coverage.

• Community Health Centers. A substantial investment in Community Health Centers will provide funding to expand access to health care in communities where it is most needed

• Rural and underserved communities. Access will be expanded through funding for rural health care providers and training programs for physician and other types of health care providers.

• Vulnerable populations. A range of new programs will tackle diseases such as cancer, diabetes, and children’s congenital heart disease, will improve the Indian Health System, and will provide support for pregnant teens and victims of domestic violence.

Identifying Alternatives to Litigation

• Testing new models. States will be eligible for grants to test alternatives to civil tort litigation that emphasize patient safety, disclosure of health care errors, and early resolution of disputes, with a provision for patients to opt-out of these alternatives at any time. Alternatives will be evaluated to determine their effectiveness.
[/FONT]

 

[klein]

Well, here is a true story, that just happened in the last 2 months.
My second cousin, Frank, a 20 yr old, overdosed on drugs in the lower Keys in Florida.
Hey got flown to Maimi, and actually clinically died twice.
They fixed him all up.
He had no health insurance.
And is no big deal.
The bill of $1.2 Million goes to tax payers.
He is still not working.
Jobs are very rare in Fl these days.
He gets by now living of his parents, and grand parents.

He does hope to get some sort of job soon. But, trust me, I was there, no help wanted signs anywhere.

He is a good kid.
Just hit a bad turn in life.
And he has been clean since, and hopefully stays that way.

But, now the question :
Is it fair tax payers need to pay for him ?
Or would it be fairer if National Healthcare, (in place), and which he also pays into, pays for it ?

 

[Catatonic]

But, now the question :
Is it fair tax payers need to pay for him ?
Or would it be fairer if National Healthcare, (in place), and which he also pays into, pays for it ?

Welcome back.
What's the difference? Taxpayers pay in each instance.

 

[Lue C Fur]

Welcome back.
What's the difference? Taxpayers pay in each instance.

Exactly...no difference. But he needs to get a job that pays well so he can be taxed.

 

[klein]

Welcome back.
What's the difference? Taxpayers pay in each instance.

Actually, here , there is a difference, and the UK, and many other countries.

Doctors and hospitals, don't bill.
They get a salary.

They are there to work on patients, not to bill by procedure.
It's like a huge cafetaria. You either feed a few more or a few less, but costs are the same.

I know, the US will never (you should never say never), but you know what I mean, will ever accept.
But, in such a program, there wouldn't really be a cost. Or atleast not as high.

Anyways, no matter what happens regarding US healthcare. The US will still have it awesome good !
Just maybe too expensive, and thats the problem.