Have you heard of the Orion System, what do you know?

[jumpman23]

orion will pbly work at a some centers,but over here in our center on the east coast where theres alot of country and tourist seasons,it aint going to work. these numbnutts who dispatch at our center have every route all jacked up. i mean literally almost all the routes have a differnt dispatch and the dol is completely garbage. i had a new supervisor do a 3 day ride with me and wanted to know if i was running route by the dol n i waz like no u cant. he looked at it and just shook his head how screwed up it is. i told him if i didnt reload the truck every morning id be out til 9 everynite with the dispatch n idiot load. so basically it could work in good centers with tight areas but country with air commits and super bad dispatch n load everyday not going to work at all not a chance in hell

 

[TheBrownGuy]

Make sure that when they ride with you to go live on your route with ORION that you tell the computer guy you will be taking your full hour everyday around noon. They have the option of not programing lunch in, this may very well bring down your projected miles. Also let him know any time commits, early closers etc....They can, but may not want to, imput a delivery time window for stops (projected miles go up), but ORION should have to deal with the same service obligations we face everyday. Break off for Business closers etc. when they ride with you. Also for the first few weeks don't leave your break till the end of the day if that is what you normally do. You will want any problems with missing time commits and possible missed/closed stops to come up while they are still working on your route. You want the problems with ORION to surface early so they have a chance to fix them. So I would follow it as close to stop for stop as possible for the first month or so. For heaven's sake don't "fix" your load the day they ride with you. They seem to take notice of how long it takes to fish out those stops on the back shelves. This might determine how they "clasify" your route and may help to determine how closely your ORION looping follows how the truck is loaded.

 

[Wally]

Removing the RDR and RDL seem really stupid. How many use them to separate stops you might have to do early? I know I do. Bury them in the load and you have missed city!

Seems to me, if they did a PAS/EDD fine tuning and let the driver do their job, they could save much more money.

 

[Indecisi0n]

Ohhh ryannnnnnn.

 

[40andOut]

ORION Delivery order map

 

[brownmonster]

View attachment 9050ORION Delivery order map

Looks about the same as my current DOL.

 

[Wally]

Looks about the same as my current DOL.

Orion is a hunter, which explains our loads.

 

[brostalss]

Funny how people with NO on road experience are going to design a system to tell us how to do our route. I'm always breaking off trace. I work smart so I don't have to work hard.

 

[soberups]

A guy on my center had his ORION "implementation ride" last week. Rural route, 85 stops, 140 miles on average. He followed ORION 100% and wound up having to give 45 stops away on 160 miles. It was a complete train wreck. The entire concept is fundamentally flawed; there is no way that a computer with GPS technology is going to "out think" a driver with 20 years of area knowledge who is looking at the load and adapting to the variables and changing conditions on a daily basis

 

[sortaisle]

Yeah...it's turning into a nightmare over here too. Most of the drivers have their miles go up by 20 miles on average. However, the ORION sup over here says if you can beat ORION by all means do it. Just get it adjusted.

 

[pretzel_man]

A guy on my center had his ORION "implementation ride" last week. Rural route, 85 stops, 140 miles on average. He followed ORION 100% and wound up having to give 45 stops away on 160 miles. It was a complete train wreck. The entire concept is fundamentally flawed; there is no way that a computer with GPS technology is going to "out think" a driver with 20 years of area knowledge who is looking at the load and adapting to the variables and changing conditions on a daily basis

From the route you mention, I would agree.

But, its not correct that the concept is flawed???

Over 3,000 drivers are using ORION today, and they have shaved off a significant amount of miles.

I truly believe what you say about your route, your center. That doesn't mean that the entire company is the same.

I've been on an ORION ride. I've seen it.

Flawed? Sure. We are all flawed.

Conceptually wrong. No.

At least not for the 3,000 drivers as a whole.

 

[IVE GOTTA PACKAGE 4U]

From the route you mention, I would agree.

But, its not correct that the concept is flawed???

Over 3,000 drivers are using ORION today, and they have shaved off a significant amount of miles.

I truly believe what you say about your route, your center. That doesn't mean that the entire company is the same.

I've been on an ORION ride. I've seen it.

Flawed? Sure. We are all flawed.

Conceptually wrong. No.

At least not for the 3,000 drivers as a whole.

Give my Orion.!!! I would love to file some more....9.5.....grievances.....SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!!!!!SUCKA

 

[jumpman23]

Another waste of millions of dollars by UPS for a system that dont work. Just like the DOL,PAL labels and the EDD. Granted they may very well work in some centers, but not in others. They tear your edd up every day and your dol because the dispatch is different every freakin day. But according to management they work. Yeah and Santa Claus,Bigfoot, and The Lochness Monster are real too lol.

 

[UPSGUY72]

From the route you mention, I would agree.

But, its not correct that the concept is flawed???

Over 3,000 drivers are using ORION today, and they have shaved off a significant amount of miles.

I truly believe what you say about your route, your center. That doesn't mean that the entire company is the same.

I've been on an ORION ride. I've seen it.

Flawed? Sure. We are all flawed.

Conceptually wrong. No.

At least not for the 3,000 drivers as a whole.

They had orion in two building in my area (that run about 25 and 20 routes on a given day) about 3 years ago they pull the plug after a year of putting people up in hotels trying to tweek the system. But as you said they are still trying to implement a system that is only as good as the people inputting the information and updating it. Kind of like just plain old EDD.

 

[didyousheetit]

Yeah...it's turning into a nightmare over here too. Most of the drivers have their miles go up by 20 miles on average. However, the ORION sup over here says if you can beat ORION by all means do it. Just get it adjusted.

they said the same thing in our building about beating the miles to go ahead and do it. Then two weeks go by and now we are back to beating 85% trace.

 

[Harry Manback]

They had orion in two building in my area (that run about 25 and 20 routes on a given day) about 3 years ago they pull the plug after a year of putting people up in hotels trying to tweek the system. But as you said they are still trying to implement a system that is only as good as the people inputting the information and updating it. Kind of like just plain old EDD.

I deliver to a wonderful lady whose son was a former pharmaceutical rep. He got laid off, (probably because he isn't a smokin hot blonde with a set legs that would give a dog a bone.). He is now a contractor implementing ORION in a center about 70 miles from me. Never touched a package with the exception of the ones left in his storage unit by his driver.

This the reality of ORION. P-man, I got loads of respect for you but, you're toeing the company line when you spew verbal diarrhea about the mileage savings. It is simply not true. I could shave 20 miles per day off my miles solution however, I'm not allowed. As could the vast majority of my center. The 85% compliance metric is far more important than individual performance. Sometimes I wonder, "How many miles could we save if you let me work as lethally efficient as I can?"

The answer is "Bollocks" it doesn't matter. Some numb nut in Atlanta has made this his saving grace/cash cow. Now, I have to run my route the way some contractor sees fit. The nuances that I know and avoid are now irrelevant. What hour will I be able to find a parking space? When will the school buses be running through this area? Shouldn't I finish this subdivision before I start another? All of that gets thrown out in pursuit of the Almighty Metric.

The response of "Uh, well, maybe you could talk to them (ORION monkeys) about it and, tell them how to fix it" is old and tiresome. I drop em off and pick em up. Preload loads em "correctly." Business Development does whatever the hell it does. Somehow, I'm supposed to fix misloads (Preload's job), develop business (BD's job) and now I gotta help some outsider contractor do his job. I won't even bore you with my 11 hour dispatch (my job).

The concept of ORION is a win for us all. The implementation is a total failure. The attempt to correct it by hiring temp-to-hire is but a band-aid applied to tumor. Spin it in any direction you wish, you'll only be polishing a turd. Ill be laughing at you when the 4 digit checks land in my checking account each week.

 

[Speedy Cerviche]

Get used to it. What we are witnessing is another policy designed to de-skill the employee. The company isn't worried about teaching this to you, the 20 year driver, you're already a lost cause for the new UPS (the new economy too - but that's another issue entirely). These types of programs are meant for the new generation that is replacing you as you retire. De-skill the driver, make the driver less important, and suddenly the driver isn't a valuable - and therefore less expensive. This system, in addition to many others we've seen, and many of the policies we suffer under are a long term solution to a long term problem - us.

 

[brownmonster]

I will run Orion for one week. I will compare stops and miles to the previous week. I will then ask my mgmnt team what I should do. No pressure.

 

[soberups]

But, its not correct that the concept is flawed???

Over 3,000 drivers are using ORION today, and they have shaved off a significant amount of miles.

P-man,

The flaw...is in the underlying assumption that the fastest and most efficient path to travel a on a given route is always the shortest.

We have drivers who have been instructed to drive out to and back from their delivery area via surface streets instead of taking the freeway or other major arterial roads. They are forced to cut through residential areas and wait at multiple stoplights. Would you agree that it takes less time to drive 20 miles on the freeway nonstop at 55mph than it does to drive 17.2 miles on congested surface streets at 35MPH with 15 stoplights to wade through? Any rational person would, but ORION doesnt. These drivers have seen an increase in idle time and paid day, and a decrease in SPORH, but none of that matters any more; in typical UPS fashion we care nothing about real-world results and everything about chasing a compliance metric.

Another flaw with ORION is the assumptions that it makes about how long it will take the driver to complete a given set of deliveries or pickups when it decides to have him break trace in order to meet some sort of a commit time. Lets say the driver has four Next Day Air stops for an office building that ORION is telling him to break trace for. If each one of the stops is for a different office on a different floor that will involve multiple waits for an elevator, he may need to arrive at that building as early as 10:10 in order to give himself time to find parking and make service on every stop prior to 10:30. If, on the other hand, all four stops are on the ground floor right next to a loading zone, he may very well be able to arrive at 10:25, which will allow him to complete the deliveries in an area instead of obeying ORION, breaking trace, and returning to that area later. Unfortunately.....the driver who uses common sense and area knowledge to make smart decisions will not be rewarded for his actions but will instead be reprimanded for failing to generate the 85% compliance metric.

There are countless other examples of situations where a driver with area knowledge and the ability to make live, firsthand observations of real-world load and traffic conditions will trump a system that is based solely upon GPS coordinates. What I am seeing is that ORION is, at best, a glorified version of EDD that might be of some value to a driver with no area knowledge but no real help at all to a driver like myself with 20 years of area knowledge. And any gains in productivity that might be realized through the intelligent and judicious use of ORION will be completely negated by the stupid and counterproductive choices we will be forced to make in order to chase a meaningless 85% compliance metric.

 

[pretzel_man]

P-man,

The flaw...is in the underlying assumption that the fastest and most efficient path to travel a on a given route is always the shortest.

We have drivers who have been instructed to drive out to and back from their delivery area via surface streets instead of taking the freeway or other major arterial roads. They are forced to cut through residential areas and wait at multiple stoplights. Would you agree that it takes less time to drive 20 miles on the freeway nonstop at 55mph than it does to drive 17.2 miles on congested surface streets at 35MPH with 15 stoplights to wade through? Any rational person would, but ORION doesnt. These drivers have seen an increase in idle time and paid day, and a decrease in SPORH, but none of that matters any more; in typical UPS fashion we care nothing about real-world results and everything about chasing a compliance metric.

Another flaw with ORION is the assumptions that it makes about how long it will take the driver to complete a given set of deliveries or pickups when it decides to have him break trace in order to meet some sort of a commit time. Lets say the driver has four Next Day Air stops for an office building that ORION is telling him to break trace for. If each one of the stops is for a different office on a different floor that will involve multiple waits for an elevator, he may need to arrive at that building as early as 10:10 in order to give himself time to find parking and make service on every stop prior to 10:30. If, on the other hand, all four stops are on the ground floor right next to a loading zone, he may very well be able to arrive at 10:25, which will allow him to complete the deliveries in an area instead of obeying ORION, breaking trace, and returning to that area later. Unfortunately.....the driver who uses common sense and area knowledge to make smart decisions will not be rewarded for his actions but will instead be reprimanded for failing to generate the 85% compliance metric.

There are countless other examples of situations where a driver with area knowledge and the ability to make live, firsthand observations of real-world load and traffic conditions will trump a system that is based solely upon GPS coordinates. What I am seeing is that ORION is, at best, a glorified version of EDD that might be of some value to a driver with no area knowledge but no real help at all to a driver like myself with 20 years of area knowledge. And any gains in productivity that might be realized through the intelligent and judicious use of ORION will be completely negated by the stupid and counterproductive choices we will be forced to make in order to chase a meaningless 85% compliance metric.

Sober....

Lets take the two situations you mention.

For the first one, the deployment team should be adjusting the MPH on the surface streets to account for lights. I've seen this done. For instance the MPH on the surface street should changed to a more realistic 23MPH. If after the adjustment ORIOON still picks the surface street, this is reasonable.

For the second item on multiple stops at an address. You are correct. I asked this myself. I was told that an update is coming to adjust for the multiple deliveries.

The question still remains however. 3,000 drivers are using the system with the flaws you mention. Significant time and miles are being saved.....

When these things are improved, I guess the savings will as well.